Nautilus 1992 July/Nautilus-3-8/Nautilus-3-8.bin/Tools & Utilities/Techy Stuff/Doco ƒ/CSMP ƒ/CSMP-V1-078.TXT

Text File | 1992-06-04 | 44.0 KB | 1,271 lines

C.S.M.P. Digest             Tue, 12 May 92       Volume 1 : Issue 78

Today's Topics:

    Question opening data fork
    Touch-a-folder code -- can someone repost?
    Does anyone know about "Time-Saver Engines"?
    question: THINK C "real window" console available?
    TextWidth Weirdness
    Reading binary input
    Symantec FTP Site
    Doing playthru on a Quadra
    How do you get the top, left, width, and heighth  from a WIND
    BASIC on the mac
    More help with app startup tracing, please.
    ATTN: Addison Weseley (sp): Book idea


The Comp.Sys.Mac.Programmer Digest is moderated by Michael A. Kelly.

These digests are available (by using FTP, account anonymous, your email
address as password) in the pub/mac/csmp-digest directory on ftp.cs.uoregon.
edu.  This is also the home of the comp.sys.mac.programmer Frequently Asked
Questions list.  The last several issues of the digest are available from
sumex-aim.stanford.edu as well.

These digests are also available via email.  Just send a note saying that you
want to be on the digest mailing list to [e-mail], and you will
automatically receive each new digest as it is created.

The digest is a collection of articles from the internet newsgroup comp.sys.
mac.programmer.  It is designed for people who read c.s.m.p. semi-regularly
and want an archive of the discussions.  If you don't know what a newsgroup
is, you probably don't have access to it.  Ask your systems administrator(s)
for details.  (This means you can't post questions to the digest.)

The articles in these digests are taken directly from comp.sys.mac.programmer.
They are not edited; all articles included in this digest are in their original
posted form.  The only articles that are -not- included in these digests are
those which didn't receive any replies (except those that give information
rather than ask a question).  All replies to each article are concatenated
onto the original article in the order in which they were received.  Article
threads are not added to the digests until the last article added to the
thread is at least one month old (this is to ensure that the thread is dead
before adding it to the digests).

Send administrative mail to [e-mail].

-------------------------------------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Question opening data fork
Date: 9 Apr 92 09:14:55 GMT
Organization: University of Kansas Academic Computing Serces

Just a quick question.  Can someone tell me what I am doing
wrong with this:

type
 FCBPBHdl = ^FCBPBPtr;
 FCBPBPtr = ^FCBPBRec;
 paramBlock = FCBPBRec;

var
 dataForkInfo: FCBPBPtr;

begin
 dataForkInfo := FCBPBPtr(NewPtr(SizeOf(paramBlock)));
 dataForkInfo^.ioRefNum := fileReferenceNumber;
 dataForkInfo^.ioFCBIndx := 0;
 OSResult := PBGetFCBInfo(dataForkInfo, false);
end;

THINK tells me that the dataForkInfo variable in the O
PBGetFCBInfo call is of the wrong type but according
to IM it is supposed to be a FCBPBPtr which I believe is
what it is      Tnaks.



exit

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Jon W{tte)
Date: 9 Apr 92 20:56:46 GMT
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden

.cc.ukans.edu> [e-mail] writes:

   begin
    dataForkInfo := FCBPBPtr(NewPtr(SizeOf(paramBlock)));
    dataForkInfo^.ioRefNum := fileReferenceNumber;
    dataForkInfo^.ioFCBIndx := 0;
    OSResult := PBGetFCBInfo(dataForkInfo, false);
   end;

   THINK tells me that the dataForkInfo variable in the O
   PBGetFCBInfo call is of the wrong type but according
   to IM it is supposed to be a FCBPBPtr which I believe is

Well, why don't you switch to "C" where a quick cast to
void * fixes it all ? :-)

Seriously, I believe it actually might need another of those
strange union types...

Anyway, you do some other things wrong, like not assigning
the ioNamePtr to point to a Str255 - even though the arrow
is pointing left, you have to do that. And you should
use NewPtrClear instead of NewPtr. And, most important,
you should de-allocate your memory when you're done...

- --
[e-mail]; Jon W{tte, the Diplomat - NOT!

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Keith Rollin)
Date: 10 Apr 92 21:35:43 GMT
Organization: Taligent

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
writes:
>
> Just a quick question.  Can someone tell me what I am doing
> wrong with this:
>
> type
>  FCBPBHdl = ^FCBPBPtr;
>  FCBPBPtr = ^FCBPBRec;
>  paramBlock = FCBPBRec;
>
> var
>  dataForkInfo: FCBPBPtr;
>
> begin
>  dataForkInfo := FCBPBPtr(NewPtr(SizeOf(paramBlock)));
>  dataForkInfo^.ioRefNum := fileReferenceNumber;
>  dataForkInfo^.ioFCBIndx := 0;
>  OSResult := PBGetFCBInfo(dataForkInfo, false);
> end;
>
> THINK tells me that the dataForkInfo variable in the O
> PBGetFCBInfo call is of the wrong type but according
> to IM it is supposed to be a FCBPBPtr which I believe is
> what it is      Tnaks.

I don't see the problem with your routine off the top of my head, but doesn't
THINK Pascal have the problem of not showing exactly where the type problem is?
For instance, could it be that the problem is with OSResult and not
dataForkInfo? Could you have declared OSResult as an INTEGER and not OSErr?

Also, what version of THINK Pascal are you using? I remember that Symantec used
to do some things with their header files that would make them differ from
Inside Mac and MPW conventions. With the latest version of THINK C and Pascal,
header/interface files are more consistant with MPW and Inside Mac.

I'd also like to mention a few pointers:

- - Don't create the parameter block on the heap. There's no need for this,
especially since you are making a synchronous call. Simply declare the buffer on
the stack and use that.

- - Fill in the ioNamePtr field. GetFCBInfo will use the value in that field as a
pointer to a string buffer into which to put the name of the file. If you leave
that field at a random value, GetFCBInfo will store the name into a random place
in memory.

I'd probably write the routine as follows:

VAR
    dataForkInfo: FCBPBRec;
    fileName: Str255;
    OSResult: OSErr;

BEGIN
    dataForkInfo.ioRefNum := fileReferenceNumber;
    dataForkInfo.ioFCBIndx := 0;
    dataForkInfo.ioNamePtr := @fileName;  { Use NIL if you don't care
                                            about receiving the name }
    OSResult := PBGetFCBInfoSync(@dataForkInfo);
    if (OSResult = noErr) DO BEGIN
        DoSomething(dataForkInfo);
    END;
END;


---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Jamie R. McCarthy)
Subject: Touch-a-folder code -- can someone repost?
Date: 9 Apr 92 21:41:48 GMT
Organization: Kalamazoo College

Someone posted code a while back to "touch" a folder of a changed file,
thus forcing the Finder to update its listing.  I can't remember what
exactly the "touch" consisted of, and I neglected to archive that
particular snippet.

Could someone re-post it, or mail it to me please?

Vielen Dank.
- --
 Jamie McCarthy     Internet: [e-mail]     AppleLink: j.mccarthy
 "Almost all portables today employ passive-matrix LCDs, and no one expects
 active-matrix screens to be cost-competitive for a few years" -PC World 2/92

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Jon W{tte)
Date: 10 Apr 92 16:11:44 GMT
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden

.kzoo.edu> [e-mail] (Jamie R. McCarthy) writes:

   Someone posted code a while back to "touch" a folder of a changed file,
   thus forcing the Finder to update its listing.  I can't remember what
   exactly the "touch" consisted of, and I neglected to archive that
   particular snippet.

It seems I play the generic folder-code server these days.
Maybe I should unsibscribe :-)

Straight from the treasure chest of my own code, for free:

void
TouchDir ( short vol , long dir ) // If the file is changed within vol , dir
{
    CInfoPBRec info ;
    Name name ;
    short err ;

    BlockClear ( & info , sizeof ( info ) ) ; // Play Safe
    info . dirInfo . ioDrDirID = dir ;
    info . dirInfo . ioVRefNum = vol ;
    info . dirInfo . ioNamePtr = name ;
    info . dirInfo . ioFDirIndex = -1 ;

    err = PBGetCatInfo ( & info , 0 ) ; // Get the info on the folder
    if ( err ) {

        return err ;
    }

    info . dirInfo . ioCompletion = 0 ;
    info . dirInfo . ioDrDirID = info . dirInfo . ioDrParID ;
    info . dirInfo . ioFDirIndex = 0 ;
    GetDateTime ( & ( info . dirInfo . ioDrMdDat ) ) ; // This is now

    err = PBSetCatInfo ( & info , 0 ) ; // Set the modified time

    return err ;
}
- --
[e-mail]; Jon W{tte, the Diplomat - NOT!

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Pietro Caselli)
Subject: Does anyone know about "Time-Saver Engines"?
Date: 10 Apr 92 11:57:22 GMT
Organization: Department of Mathematics, University of Bologna, Italy

I hope that the Mac programmer community could help me. I do not usually
read this newsgroup, so this may have come out agin in the past. Please
forgive me it this is so, and answer me nonetheless.

I have found in an old copy of the Mac Development Tool & Languages
Guidebook (Fall 1989) an advertisement page about some source code called
"Time-Saver Engines", containing a full-featured WP, an object oriented draw
editor and a finder-like interface, from a SW firm called "DataPak Software"

I tried to phone them, but the firm has moved and a different firm answered.
I don't have a newer copy of the Guidebook, so I cannot check whether the
advertisement page still exists.

All I have is their address,
DataPak Software, Inc.
14011 Ventura Boulevard #507
Sherman Oaks, CA 91423
Tel. 818 - 905-6419

Does anyone know whether this firm still exists and sells this software? If
it does, what is their address, telephone, fax or E-mail? If it does not, do
you know whether it is possible to directly contact the authors or have in
any other way a personal agreement for obtaining that code?

I have used a friend account as there are some problem with my access to
the news, and I don't usually read this newsgroup, so please e-mail me
directly at
[e-mail].

Thank you very much.

Fabio Vitali

- --
Fabio Vitali                  There's a clear morale to this tale, now that
Dept of Computer Science     I think about it: when you're dead you're dead.
Univ. of Bologna  ITALY             And yet another morale occurs to me now:
e-mail: [e-mail]         make love when you can. It's good for you.
                                                              Kurt Vonnegut
- --
Pietro Caselli                |
Internet: [e-mail]    |    IF YOU MEET THE BUDDHA
      [e-mail]    |     ON THE ROAD,KILL HIM.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Jon W{tte)
Date: 10 Apr 92 16:16:04 GMT
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden

.cineca.it> [e-mail] (Pietro Caselli) writes:

   I have found in an old copy of the Mac Development Tool & Languages
   Guidebook (Fall 1989) an advertisement page about some source code called
   "Time-Saver Engines", containing a full-featured WP, an object oriented draw
   editor and a finder-like interface, from a SW firm called "DataPak Software"

   Does anyone know whether this firm still exists and sells this software? If

Yes, it's called the word solutions engine these days, and has lots
of add-ons available.

   it does, what is their address, telephone, fax or E-mail? If it does not, do
   you know whether it is possible to directly contact the authors or have in

DataPak Software Inc
9317 NE Highway 99, Suite G
Vancouver, Washington
98665-8900
fax [phone]
- --
[e-mail]; Jon W{tte, the Diplomat - NOT!

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Eli K. Burk)
Subject: question: THINK C "real window" console available?
Date: 9 Apr 92 20:41:14 GMT

I am learning C and have decided to learn C first -then- experiment
with the toolbox. However THINK C's console.h does not include a
"real" mac window - has anyone written one. The best case would one in
which I could just comment out console.h an have the code be ansi
compliant.

If one doesn't exist perhaps someone could make one available for ftp.

eli

p.s. thanks to all that helped me before
   (i.e. the "help me help myself" posting)

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Doug McNought)
Date: 10 Apr 92 03:27:22 GMT
Organization: California Institute of Technology


In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Eli K. Burk) writes:

   I am learning C and have decided to learn C first -then- experiment
   with the toolbox. However THINK C's console.h does not include a
   "real" mac window - has anyone written one. The best case would one in
   which I could just comment out console.h an have the code be ansi
   compliant.

   If one doesn't exist perhaps someone could make one available for ftp.

What do you mean, "real"?? I am befogged. Please be more specific.

- -doug
- --
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>Go Orioles<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
<> Doug McNaught                          [e-mail] <>
<>  Help!!! I'm addicted to *Spaceward Ho!* Is there a support group? <>
<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>Go Orioles<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Joe Zobkiw)
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 14:11:29 GMT

<< If one doesn't exist perhaps someone could make one available for ftp.
>>

Hmmm...this makes no sense to me. If it doesn't exist, how can it be
made available?

In any case...you probably mean scrolling window? I would agree that it
would be nice if THINK C's console window was a bit more like MPW's
worksheet. I don't know if anything like this exists...but it may.


- --
<--------------------------------------------------->
 joe zobkiw                     [e-mail]
 mac.synthesis.MIDI.development.C.asm.communications
>---------------------------------------------------<

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Mike Smithwick)
Subject: TextWidth Weirdness
Date: 9 Apr 92 20:46:07 GMT
Organization: SF-Bay Public-Access Unix

[]

I am calling TextWidth to determine the width of a rectangle I need
to block out some text, but the width is always falling short of the
true width on the screen. It's coming out to be something like 80% of the
real width. So the longer the string the more characters it skips. Is
there something strange about TextWidth that I'm missing?


mike

- --
"There is no problem too big that can't be solved with high explosives"-Rush

Mike Smithwick - ames!zorch!mike

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Joe Zobkiw)
Date: 10 Apr 92 14:16:20 GMT
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA

<< I am calling TextWidth to determine the width of a rectangle I need
to block out some text, but the width is always falling short of the
true width on the screen. It's coming out to be something like 80% of the
real width. So the longer the string the more characters it skips. Is
there something strange about TextWidth that I'm missing? >>

TextWidth probably works on the current port and the current font, size, and
style (etc.) so you should make sure all of these things are set correctly
before making to call.


- --
<--------------------------------------------------->
 joe zobkiw                     [e-mail]
 mac.synthesis.MIDI.development.C.asm.communications
>---------------------------------------------------<

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (USENET News System)
Subject: Reading binary input
Date: 9 Apr 92 23:25:41 GMT
Organization: SMIS, Massey University, NZ

This is a posting on behalf of a student without News access.  He wants source
code (any language) which takes a stream of binary input from a synchronous A/D
converter plugged into a serial port of a IIci, and read it into a file.
Someone has already suggested using the Sound Manager library, any comments on
this, or other suggestions?

Phil Etheridge              Internet: [e-mail]
Macintosh Consultant        Phone:    +64+6-356 9099 ext 8689
SMIS, Massey University     Fax:      +64+6-350 5611
Palmerston North, NZ        40*23'S, 175*37'E ;  GMT+12

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Joe Zobkiw)
Date: 10 Apr 92 14:19:32 GMT
Organization: The World Public Access UNIX, Brookline, MA

<< This is a posting on behalf of a student without News access.  He wants source
code (any language) which takes a stream of binary input from a synchronous A/D
converter plugged into a serial port of a IIci, and read it into a file.
Someone has already suggested using the Sound Manager library, any comments on
this, or other suggestions? >>

You might want to check out the MacRecorder Hackers Toolkit which may
still be available from Macromind/Paracomp. I know it's on America Online
and probably CI$. It shows how to read and write audio data to the serial
port and may be what you need.


- --
<--------------------------------------------------->
 joe zobkiw                     [e-mail]
 mac.synthesis.MIDI.development.C.asm.communications
>---------------------------------------------------<

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (William Logan Lee)
Date: 11 Apr 92 08:39:40 GMT
Organization: Uni Computing Service, Uni of Sydney, Australia

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>This is a posting on behalf of a student without News access.  He wants source
>code (any language) which takes a stream of binary input from a synchronous A/D
>converter plugged into a serial port of a IIci, and read it into a file.
>Someone has already suggested using the Sound Manager library, any comments on
>this, or other suggestions?

Perhaps I am misunderstanding the problem, but why doesn't he use a terminal
emulator like "kermit" or "zterm" to capture the input, if it does not need
to be processed in real time?

If the information needs to be processed real-time, then what about using the
Communications Toolbox routines?

Although not recommended (but sometimes you have no choice), you can input
a clock signal for some non-standard baud rate input to the port.  You then
have to muck about directly with the serial chip.

Could you post a bit more info on what sort of input to the serial port
you are trying to read and also whether there is real time processing
needed?

>Phil Etheridge

Bill Lee

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (JASON HOLTZAPPLE)
Subject: Symantec FTP Site
Date: 9 Apr 92 23:12:09 GMT
Organization: Duke University; Durham, N.C.

Thanks to all of you who let me know that Symantec's ftp site is at

ics.uci.edu
in the mac/thinkc directory

This info should be useful since I didn't see it in the FAQ.
- -Jason Holtz



- --
| ****  Jason Holtz                      [e-mail]  ***** |
| ****  "And the knowledge that they fear is a weapon to be  ***** |
| ****           used against them" - Rush,  1982            ***** |

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Jakob Nielsen)
Date: 10 Apr 92 20:12:51 GMT
Organization: Bellcore - Bell Communications Research

OK, so what is the FTP site for Think *Pascal* ?
- --
Jakob Nielsen, [e-mail], fax (201)  829-2645
Bellcore, MRE 2P-370, 445 South St., Morristown, NJ 09792-1910, USA

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Tobish E Smith)
Subject: Doing playthru on a Quadra
Date: 10 Apr 92 21:15:57 GMT
Organization: University of Pittsburgh

I'm trying to get continuous sound play-thru on my Quadra (a la the Audio
dialog box in Hypercard 2.1).  Having purused IM VI, it _seems_ that this
should be possible with just two calls:

err = SPBOpenDevice(NIL, siWritePermission, &myRefNum);
SPBSetDeviceInfo(myRefNum, siPlayThruOnOff, daPtr);

(where the value in daPtr is something between 1 and 7)

I know there's a little PD program available (actually, it may be shareware...)
called PlayThru which is supposed to do just this, but it doesn't work on
my Quadra (even though the play-thru in Hypercard works fine), so I'm
suspecting that perhaps the Q requires some extra code or something.  Can
anyone shed some light on this please?

Thanks,
Tob

[e-mail]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Shawn James Cokus)
Date: 11 Apr 92 14:38:38 GMT
Organization: Freshman, Math/Computer Science, Carnegie Mellon, Pittsburgh, PA


>I'm trying to get continuous sound play-thru on my Quadra (a la the Audio
>dialog box in Hypercard 2.1).  Having purused IM VI, it _seems_ that this
>should be possible with just two calls:
>
>err = SPBOpenDevice(NIL, siWritePermission, &myRefNum);
>SPBSetDeviceInfo(myRefNum, siPlayThruOnOff, daPtr);
>
>(where the value in daPtr is something between 1 and 7)
>
>I know there's a little PD program available (actually, it may be
shareware...)
>called PlayThru which is supposed to do just this, but it doesn't work on
>my Quadra (even though the play-thru in Hypercard works fine), so I'm
>suspecting that perhaps the Q requires some extra code or something.  Can
>anyone shed some light on this please?
>
>Thanks,
>Tob
>
>[e-mail]

I'm the author of "Play-Thru!" and the problem really isn't the Quadra,
but System 7.0.1.  When 7.0 was around, those two calls above would have
set play-through on.  However, something odd happened and now you also
have to turn on meter levelling.  Don't ask why.  Don't ask how long it
took me to figure that out.  ;-)  Anyways, I've been meaning to fix
Play-Thru! 1.0 for a while, but in the process I've also been doing a
massive overhaul into a cdev/INIT thing with new features; I can't
promise it anytime soon...

- --Shawn.

---------------------------

From: Charles McClary <[e-mail]>
Subject: How do you get the top, left, width, and heighth  from a WIND
Organization: Indiana University
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 92 21:27:50 GMT



+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (JohnC)
Organization: The Royal Society for Putting Things on Top of Other Things
Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1992 22:01:55 GMT

Here's some code:

TYPE

  WindowTHndl = ^WindowTPtr;
  WindowTPtr = ^WindowTemplate;
  WindowTemplate = record
    bounds: rect;
    procID: integer;
    visible: boolean;
    filler1: boolean;
    goAwayFlag: boolean;
    filler2: boolean;
    refCon: longint;
    title: Str255;
   end; { WindowTemplate = record }


Just use this type to cast the result of _GetResource.  Also, be aware that
System 7 adds additional fields to the window template to implement the new
auto-position feature (and possibly other things I don't know about).


- --
John Cavallino                  |  EMail: [e-mail]
University of Chicago Hospitals |         [e-mail]
Office of Facilities Management | USMail: 5841 S. Maryland Ave, MC 0953
B0 f++ c+ g+ k s++ e+ h- pv     |         Chicago, IL  60637

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (John E Bush)
Date: 11 Apr 92 04:20:44 GMT
Organization: The Ohio State University

This message is responded to as if you are using Think Pascal's library, but
there is probably something equivalent for other development environments:

There is a procedure in the CWindow class that returns a structure to you
called GetFrame(var theFrame:LongRect) which returns the size of the
window to you.

---------------------------

Organization: City University of New York/ University Computer Center
Date: Monday, 16 Mar 1992 19:26:39 EST
From: <[e-mail]>
Subject: BASIC on the mac

A programmer I know who uses Micrsoft QuickBASIC for IBM compatibles is

planning to do some work on the Mac and has asked me to pass on any helpful
information regarding the availability of BASIC compilers for the mac.

He is also interested in participating in any Macintosh application users'

groups.


Thanks in advance for any info...


+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Ray Arachelian)
Date: 27 Mar 92 04:02:00 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:2603/204 - Not Even Odd, Forest Hills NY

On 03-16-92, [e-mail] wrote to ALL:

 V> A programmer I know who uses Micrsoft QuickBASIC for IBM compatibles
 V> is
 V>
 V> planning to do some work on the Mac and has asked me to pass on any
 V> helpful information regarding the availability of BASIC compilers for
 V> the mac.

Microsoft has a Basic compiler for the Mac.  There is also a company
called Zedcor which produces a product called ZBasic.

 * Freddie 1.1 * You have been found guilty of commerce with the devil.

- --
=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=
 Ray Arachelian - Internet: [e-mail]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Takeshi Miyazaki)
Organization: Princeton University
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1992 05:50:02 GMT

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Ray Arachelian) writes:
>Microsoft has a Basic compiler for the Mac.  There is also a company
>called Zedcor which produces a product called ZBasic.

Are they System 7 compatible?

- --
Takeshi Miyazaki ([e-mail])

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Ray Arachelian)
Date: 9 Apr 92 21:59:00 GMT
Organization: FidoNet node 1:2603/204 - Not Even Odd, Forest Hills NY

On 04-01-92, [e-mail] wrote to ALL:

 M>  Are they System 7 compatible?

ZBasic isn't System 7 savvy, but it sure as hell is system 7 compatible.

 * Freddie 1.2b7 * You have been found guilty of commerce with the devil.

- --
=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=*=
 Ray Arachelian - Internet: [e-mail]

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Nick B Triantos)
Subject: More help with app startup tracing, please.
Date: 19 Mar 92 14:21:27 GMT
Organization: The University at Buffalo

Hi.

Thanks to all who helped me with info about tracing the loading of an
application.  I understand that CODE #0 sets up the jump table, but I'm still
unclear as to what happens from there.  A pointer is DEC.W'd (decremented,
right?), and then a MOVE.W takes place, then _LoadSeg is called.  After all of
these steps are repeated, though, how am I able to know what segment is going
to be JMP'ed to?  For example, here's just one I'll make up:

   000020  DC.W      $0092
   000022  MOVE.W    #$0001,-(A7)
   000026  _LoadSeg

so, offset $0092 in segment CODE #1 is loaded, right?  Does the JMP simply go
to the first code segment in the jump table?

Thanks in advance for any help...

- -Nick

- --
Nick Triantos   Grad Student, University at Buffalo.  Why?  I DON'T KNOW!
     "...and besides, she's a psycho hose-beast." - Wayne, from Wayne's World

I! Hi'm a mtatng siugnaturei vir*ss. You cann~t reisth elping me  spre]d !

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Matthew T. Russotto)
Date: Thu, 19 Mar 92 15:09:45 GMT
Organization: College of Engineering, University of Maryland, College Park

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Nick B Triantos) writes:
>Hi.
>
>Thanks to all who helped me with info about tracing the loading of an
>application.  I understand that CODE #0 sets up the jump table, but I'm still
>unclear as to what happens from there.  A pointer is DEC.W'd (decremented,
>right?), and then a MOVE.W takes place, then _LoadSeg is called.
Nope, the 68000 has no DEC instruction.  "DC.W" means "stick this word
length data in the code space"-- it is not an instruction.  The code
that loads the app jumps to the MOVE instruction

> After all of
>these steps are repeated, though, how am I able to know what segment is going
>to be JMP'ed to?  For example, here's just one I'll make up:
>
>   000020  DC.W      $0092
>   000022  MOVE.W    #$0001,-(A7)
>   000026  _LoadSeg
>
>so, offset $0092 in segment CODE #1 is loaded, right?  Does the JMP simply go
>to the first code segment in the jump table?

Loadseg patches the location it is called from, resulting in the above
being changed to
  000020 DC.W  $0092
  000022 JMP  xxxxxxxx

Where 'xxxxxxxx' is the location in memory of the routine referred to.

- --
Matthew T. Russotto    [e-mail]    [e-mail]
Some news readers expect "Disclaimer:" here.
Just say NO to police searches and seizures.  Make them use force.
(not responsible for bodily harm resulting from following above advice)

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Tim Dierks, ToyMeister, Cray abuser)
Date: 31 Mar 92 03:58:50 GMT
Organization: MacDTS, Apple Computer

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Matthew T. Russotto) writes:
> > After all of
> >these steps are repeated, though, how am I able to know what segment is going
> >to be JMP'ed to?  For example, here's just one I'll make up:
> >
> >   000020  DC.W      $0092
> >   000022  MOVE.W    #$0001,-(A7)
> >   000026  _LoadSeg
> >
> >so, offset $0092 in segment CODE #1 is loaded, right?  Does the JMP simply go
> >to the first code segment in the jump table?
>
> Loadseg patches the location it is called from, resulting in the above
> being changed to
>   000020 DC.W  $0092
>   000022 JMP  xxxxxxxx
>
> Where 'xxxxxxxx' is the location in memory of the routine referred to.

Useful hint:

You can't trace over LoadSeg.  This is because LoadSeg never returns; instead,
it jumps through to the call you intend to go to.  So what you can do is set
the low memory global LoadTrap to a non-zero value, and the segment loader will
break into the debugger before it jumps to the destination.  (LoadTrap is a
byte-long global at address $12D.  In MacsBug, type "sb loadtrap 1" to turn
this on and "sb loadtrap 0" to turn it off.  If you're running without a
complete Debugger Prefs file, replace "loadtrap" with "12D".)

This is also really useful if you want to break at the start of a call, but its
segment has not been loaded yet.  You can break after the LoadSeg by setting
loadtrap, and each time check to see if the function has been loaded yet.

Enjoy!
Tim Dierks
MacDTS, but I'm not _all_ bad.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Michael Hecht)
Date: 31 Mar 92 22:36:24 GMT
Organization: SAS Institute Inc.

In article <[e-mail]>,
   [e-mail] (Tim Dierks, ToyMeister, Cray abuser) writes:
>
> In article <[e-mail]>,
>    [e-mail] (Matthew T. Russotto) writes:
> > > After all of these steps are repeated, though, how am I able to know
> > > what segment is going to be JMP'ed to?
>
> Useful hint:
>
> You can't trace over LoadSeg.  This is because LoadSeg never returns; instead,
> it jumps through to the call you intend to go to.  So what you can do is set
> the low memory global LoadTrap to a non-zero value, and the segment loader will
> break into the debugger before it jumps to the destination.

The "Debugger Prefs" file that comes with MacsBug 6.2.2 includes a handy macro
for doing exactly that:

  GS

which is defined as

  SB 12D 1;G;T 2;SB 12D 0


- --Michael

=======================================================================
Michael P. Hecht                 | Internet:  [e-mail]
SAS Institute Inc.; Cary, NC USA | AppleLink: SAS.HECHT

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Nick B Triantos)
Date: 1 Apr 92 05:57:43 GMT
Organization: The University at Buffalo

Forgive me for sounding naive, but I'm still not really able to follow what is
going on during the segment loading process.  CODE 0 tells the system to load a
segment, maybe more than one at a time.  Then it (I think) JMP's to the
beginning of the segment, yes?  I think that if I'm able to see what a program
is doing just before, during, and after its startup screen is displayed, I may
be able to figure out why I can't get it to work correctly.

I'm no longer interested in making the program work, but I'd really love to
understand the application startup process better.

Thanks,
- -Nick


- --
Nick Triantos   Grad Student, University at Buffalo.  Why?  I DON'T KNOW!
     "...and besides, she's a psycho hose-beast." - Wayne, from Wayne's World

I! Hi'm a mtatng siugnaturei vir*ss. You cann~t reisth elping me  spre]d !

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Jon W{tte)
Date: 2 Apr 92 08:31:25 GMT
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden

.buffalo.edu> [e-mail] (Nick B Triantos) writes:

   Forgive me for sounding naive, but I'm still not really able to follow
   what is going on during the segment loading process.  CODE 0 tells the
   system to load a segment, maybe more than one at a time.  Then it
   (I think) JMP's to the beginning of the segment, yes?

No.

Inside Mac II has an explanation of the jump tables, and it's
really not that hard to follow. A jump table entry for an unloaded
segment consists of some offset information, segment information,
and a LoadSeg trap. The LoadSeg trap checks who called it (the jump
table; code 0) to get at the offset and segment information, and
then loads that code resource, and jumps to the specified offset
in that resource, after changing the entry in the jump table to
a "JMP" instruction pointing at the now loaded code, and flushing
the cache.

As you see, a maximum of one segment is ever loaded at one time.
What happens at startup is that your heap gets initialized, and
the system runs the first jump table entry of CODE 0. The rest is
up to what the compiler/linker generated.

Some early viruses used this mechanism to patch into applications.
However, any "generic" virus checker catches tampering with these
structures now, so doing it again would be pretty pointless.

- --
[e-mail]; Jon W{tte, the Diplomat - NOT!

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Kent Sandvik)
Date: 10 Apr 92 01:46:54 GMT
Organization: MacDTS Mongols

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail]
(Nick B Triantos) writes:
>
> Forgive me for sounding naive, but I'm still not really able to follow what is
> going on during the segment loading process.  CODE 0 tells the system to load
a
> segment, maybe more than one at a time.  Then it (I think) JMP's to the
> beginning of the segment, yes?  I think that if I'm able to see what a program
> is doing just before, during, and after its startup screen is displayed, I may
> be able to figure out why I can't get it to work correctly.
>
> I'm no longer interested in making the program work, but I'd really love to
> understand the application startup process better.

Inside Macintosh, Second book, Segment Loader (second chapter) is what you need
to read.

Speaking about runtime issues, and especially model far which is a new beast
to understand, the forthcoming MPW documentation has a good chapter which
has an inside-out description of how everything works together. I can't say
the exact day/time this documentation is ready, but we are speaking about months
or maybe weeks.

Cheers,
Kent Sandvik
Dynamic Language Materialist

---------------------------

From: [e-mail] (Eric W. Sink)
Subject: ATTN: Addison Weseley (sp): Book idea
Date: 1 Apr 92 14:52:04 GMT
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign

I want a SMALL, INEXPENSIVE, INCOMPLETE reference to the Mac
Toolbox.  I'm thinking, like the size of a Star Trek novel,
selling for 5.95 or something like that.  Pack all the info you
can into this thing of course, but I'd be happy with a prototype
and a one line description of every toolbox call.
I don't want IM crammed into a pocket book.  I want a pocket book
with as much Mac info as possible.

Anybody else think this would be handy ?

- --
Eric W. Sink,  Spatial Analysis and Systems Team
USACERL, P.O. Box 9005, Champaign, IL 61826-9005
1-800-USA-CERL x449,   [e-mail]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Thomas Alan Akins)
Organization: /local/lib/rn/organization
Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1992 21:49:22 GMT

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] writes:
>I want a SMALL, INEXPENSIVE, INCOMPLETE reference to the Mac
>Toolbox.  I'm thinking, like the size of a Star Trek novel,
>selling for 5.95 or something like that.  Pack all the info you
>can into this thing of course, but I'd be happy with a prototype
>and a one line description of every toolbox call.
>I don't want IM crammed into a pocket book.  I want a pocket book
>with as much Mac info as possible.
>
>Anybody else think this would be handy ?

Could be... But why whine at A-W? They just publish, they don't write.  If you
want a book like that, write one yourself or (and this is REALLY outlandish)
try asking Apple about it.

About the price... well... you get what you pay for...

- --
*                                            Alan Akins                      *
*       "I could say 'addition'              [e-mail]            *
*        when I mean ... 'basketball.'"      University of Oregon            *
*                        - E. Tick           Department of Computer Science  *

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Aaron Giles)
Date: 1 Apr 92 22:24:54 GMT
Organization: University of Chicago High Energy Physics


>I want a SMALL, INEXPENSIVE, INCOMPLETE reference to the Mac
>Toolbox.  I'm thinking, like the size of a Star Trek novel,
>selling for 5.95 or something like that.  Pack all the info you
>can into this thing of course, but I'd be happy with a prototype
>and a one line description of every toolbox call.

Get yourself a copy of SaveATree and the MPW C .h files (from
ftp.apple.com).  Works for me ... at least until I can afford the IM
volumes! :-)

Aaron
- -----
                     Aaron Giles -- [e-mail]
           "You can't have everything ... where would you put it?"

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Eric W. Sink)
Organization: University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1992 14:03:35 GMT

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Thomas Alan Akins) writes:

>Could be... But why whine at A-W? They just publish, they don't write.  If you
>want a book like that, write one yourself or (and this is REALLY outlandish)
>try asking Apple about it.

Whine ?

Point taken, AW doesn't publish, but it seemed plausible to me that they
know a few people who do write.  You know, like maybe they know them better
than I do.  Maybe they could suggest that one of them write it.  It's
more of a compilation task than a writing one in my opinion.  Still, it
seemed to me that AW has more contacts in the writing industry.
Besides, I only stuck AW in the title because I know they do tech stuff.
I certainly didn't expect anyone at AW to read the message.

Whine ?!?

Write it myself ?  Not an atrocious idea, but I can't really say that I
have the time.

WHINE ???!!!!!

Ask Apple about it ?  Yes, very outlandish.  After six months, 2 emails,
2 written letters, and one phone call, I've *just* gotten the paperwork
I needed from Apple licensing; and they sent the wrong forms.  Square one,
here I come.

- --
Eric W. Sink,  Spatial Analysis and Systems Team
USACERL, P.O. Box 9005, Champaign, IL 61826-9005
1-800-USA-CERL x449,   [e-mail]

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Jon W{tte)
Date: 2 Apr 92 22:22:49 GMT
Organization: Royal Institute of Technology, Stockholm, Sweden

.uoregon.edu> [e-mail] (Thomas Alan Akins) writes:

   The Mean C Compiler Author writes:

   >selling for 5.95 or something like that.  Pack all the info you
   >can into this thing of course, but I'd be happy with a prototype
   >and a one line description of every toolbox call.

   >I don't want IM crammed into a pocket book.  I want a pocket book
   >with as much Mac info as possible.

   Could be... But why whine at A-W? They just publish, they don't write.
   If you want a book like that, write one yourself or (and this is REALLY
   outlandish) try asking Apple about it.

   About the price... well... you get what you pay for...


Using "egrep" it took me all of a minute to generate that book !
Just filter the headers in some nice way, and there is your book.
You could even print it on a laser and fold it yourself !

Or at least, that info could serve as a nice ground for something
with added text and styling.

- --
[e-mail]; Jon W{tte, the Diplomat - NOT!

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Erik Svensson)
Date: 3 Apr 92 09:30:49 GMT
Organization: FOA, Linkoping, Sweden

[e-mail] (Eric W. Sink) writes:

>I want a SMALL, INEXPENSIVE, INCOMPLETE reference to the Mac
>Toolbox.  I'm thinking, like the size of a Star Trek novel,
>selling for 5.95 or something like that.  Pack all the info you
>can into this thing of course, but I'd be happy with a prototype
>and a one line description of every toolbox call.
>I don't want IM crammed into a pocket book.  I want a pocket book
>with as much Mac info as possible.

>Anybody else think this would be handy ?

Well, I'd buy it. Perhaps add a "Where-to-look-for-more-info-about-this-call"
line.

>--
>Eric W. Sink,  Spatial Analysis and Systems Team
>USACERL, P.O. Box 9005, Champaign, IL 61826-9005
>1-800-USA-CERL x449,   [e-mail]

Erik Svensson, Guided Weapons Division, National Defense Research Establishment
(FOA) Stockholm, Sweden
- --
Erik Svensson            Research Officer
Guided Weapons Division        National Defense Research Establishment (FOA)
Stockholm            Sweden

net.address:     [e-mail]    /* preferred */
        [e-mail]

&& This .sig is protected by SIGinfectant(tm). Look for the &&, a sure sign of

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Thomas Burglin)
Date: 6 Apr 92 06:25:00 GMT
Organization: Molecular Biology, Massachusetts General Hospital, Boston

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Erik Svensson) writes...
>[e-mail] (Eric W. Sink) writes:
>
>>I want a SMALL, INEXPENSIVE, INCOMPLETE reference to the Mac
>>Toolbox.  I'm thinking, like the size of a Star Trek novel,
>>selling for 5.95 or something like that.  Pack all the info you
>>can into this thing of course, but I'd be happy with a prototype
>>and a one line description of every toolbox call.
>>I don't want IM crammed into a pocket book.  I want a pocket book
>>with as much Mac info as possible.
>
>>Anybody else think this would be handy ?

Well, I also wish for something like that.  At the moment the
best alternative for me is Think Reference, but it's missing Volume 6.
Thomas Burglin

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Thomas Burglin)
Date: 6 Apr 92 06:25:00 GMT
Organization: Molecular Biology, Massachusetts General Hospital, Boston

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Erik Svensson) writes...
>[e-mail] (Eric W. Sink) writes:
>
>>I want a SMALL, INEXPENSIVE, INCOMPLETE reference to the Mac
>>Toolbox.  I'm thinking, like the size of a Star Trek novel,
>>selling for 5.95 or something like that.  Pack all the info you
>>can into this thing of course, but I'd be happy with a prototype
>>and a one line description of every toolbox call.
>>I don't want IM crammed into a pocket book.  I want a pocket book
>>with as much Mac info as possible.
>
>>Anybody else think this would be handy ?

Well, I also wish for something like that.  At the moment the
best alternative for me is Think Reference, but it's missing Volume 6.
Thomas Burglin

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++

From: [e-mail] (Kent Sandvik)
Date: 10 Apr 92 22:58:57 GMT
Organization: MacDTS Mongols

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Eric W.
Sink) writes:
>
> I want a SMALL, INEXPENSIVE, INCOMPLETE reference to the Mac
> Toolbox.  I'm thinking, like the size of a Star Trek novel,
> selling for 5.95 or something like that.  Pack all the info you
> can into this thing of course, but I'd be happy with a prototype
> and a one line description of every toolbox call.
> I don't want IM crammed into a pocket book.  I want a pocket book
> with as much Mac info as possible.
>
> Anybody else think this would be handy ?

Robin Muir and Jeff Alger did a similar book long time ago for
MacApp 2.0, MADA published this one and it run out of stock/print
within months. I'm sure there's a market for a similar small
spiral-bound lookup-manual. Check out the MacApp version for the
design, it's really slick.

Kent
..who never got one of 'em.

---------------------------

End of C.S.M.P. Digest
**********************